Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 12, 2022 12:42:56 GMT
And again... to complete my wishlist another point, i would wish for.:
15) That the firewall GUI IS installed by default, or at least to ask the user at the installation if he or she wants it to be installed and enabled.
Actually, this would be the first thing that i would like to be enabled by default. Cause a firewall... its needful.
Especially maybe newbies like me dont think at that topic in the very first moment. They may think that the firewall and the GUI is available and enabled by default cause of their experiences with OSX or Windows.
From all i know know now, after dealing with different distros and Bodhi, there still is a huge difference between Linux and other OSs. I quote myself now, to complete my wishlist....
in addition to my list below, i would wish:
13) Ruffle or Flash should also be automatically installable during the installation routine. Yes I know that all this could make the distro a bit bigger to download, so I would put all these things in the APP-Pack distro.
14) Maybe also different kernels to choose from. Because I still do not know how to downgrade a kernel. Nobody tells me...
1) The installation should be simple 2) No features like automatic connection to any clouds, messengers, online services. 3) Components like virtual desktops etc..., should not be activated automatically. But the user should activate these components themselves if the user wants that. 4) In general, no automatic default settings should be made. Instead, the user should be asked during installation whether such components should be enabled or not. 5) In the system settings there should be only one big panel, where all system settings are easy to find and not with many small submenus. 6) The foreign language support should be 100% correct. Errors only cause confusion. 7) Current multimedia codex should be available. 8) During installation, hardware routines should clarify via software whether a graphics card can be used in the system or not. Likewise with other hardware such as sound cards, chipset etc.. Backwardcompatibility to older hardware should be given... If the components are not compatible, an installation routine should tell the user that his system is not supported. 9) Web browsers should either be offered by different manufacturers for installation or none. 10) All Google products should not be installed automatically during installation. 11) There always should be two downloadversion. One Slimline and one Fullsize, with Programms, Wallpapers aso... Because i am a user who prefers the Fullsizeversions than the Slimelineversions.
12) It would be great, if there would be a possibility for new users to understand at Linux, how to install downloaded driver or programs, which are gzip, tar or other kind of packed programs. Because pograms like ARC doesnt work on my Distro correctly...
And again... to complete my wishlist another point, i would wish for.:
15) That the firewall GUI IS installed by default, or at least to ask the user at the installation if he or she wants it to be installed and enabled.
Actually, this would be the first thing that i would like to be enabled by default. Cause a firewall... its needful.
Especially maybe newbies like me dont think at that topic in the very first moment. They may think that the firewall and the GUI is available and enabled by default cause of their experiences with OSX or Windows.
From all i know know now, after dealing with different distros and Bodhi, there still is a huge difference between Linux and other OSs.
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enigma9o7
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Post by enigma9o7 on Feb 12, 2022 15:28:00 GMT
As far as I know, I don't have any use for a firewall on my pc, my router takes care of that functionality. I'd imagine most Bodhi users never install a firewall. So I suggest do not install it by default.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 12, 2022 16:39:02 GMT
...... my router takes care of that functionality. I'd imagine most Bodhi users never install a firewall. So I suggest do not install it by default. Well, it maybe is a solution at your side with the router.... but did you ever think about the people who ...
1) Do not know about the possibility to have it done with a router 2) Some routers dont have it 3) missing skills of users to set these settings in their routers? 4) As i know, the FW is installed by BH-E25-6. but wasnt enabled by default and had no gui installed
So, do you think it is a good advice to say to the newbies that they shouldnt know if they have a FW and if that FW is enabled or not? So that they are surfing without the least of protection? Cause your post says that.
I would always try to help newbies to not only have a Linux system but to have a kind of protection too.
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Post by Hippytaff on Feb 12, 2022 16:44:49 GMT
Any router kind of acts as a really good defence for a home network by their nature. On a secure home network, all your stuff is hidden from the outside internet by the router. Additional firewalls are an extra, some argue a redundant and unnecessary layer. If you use your laptop on public networks, like a cafe or train, then a firewall will be more useful, as there is more potential for attacks to come from within the network you are on (other users on the same network). There is nothing wrong with having one. I never have on my machines. I do with a cloud web server I keep breaking myself, without any help from hackers lol. For that I use ufw.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 12, 2022 16:53:28 GMT
Yes a firewall is useful. In addition, the users themselves should always decide what they want. If users feel safer with a firewall then they should have it. No matter if other people think that it is not necessary, if they have router. It is undeniable that any -more protection- also offers more protection and be it only in small areas or public networks. More is more.
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enigma9o7
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Post by enigma9o7 on Feb 12, 2022 17:06:11 GMT
Well, it maybe is a solution at your side with the router.... but did you ever think about the people who ... 1) Do not know about the possibility to have it done with a router 2) Some routers dont have it 3) missing skills of users to set these settings in their routers? 4) As i know, the FW is installed by E25 but wasnt enabled by default and had no gui installed
So, do you think it is a good advice to say to the newbies that they shouldnt know if they have a FW and if that FW is enabled or not? So that they are surfing without the least of protection? Cause your post says that.
I would always try to help newbies to not only have a Linux system but to have a kind of protection too.
There is no need for me to think about those people, because Bodhi doesn't target them. One of Bodhi's focus is minimilism, not having extra stuff not everyone would use installed. So no, unless it is something 90% of people need, I don't think bodhi should include it. There are other distros with tons of crap installed for newbies. In all of history, have you ever heard of a Bodhi user having an issue due to lack of firewall being installed? Nope.
But I would not say it is not good advice to know things. Knowledge is good. Feel free to install yourself firewalls and antivirus and any other crap you want, that's your choice, Bodhi tries to be a minimal canvas allowing you to install whatever you want, whatever config GUI's you want, etc.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 12, 2022 19:08:41 GMT
Well, it maybe is a solution at your side with the router.... but did you ever think about the people who ... 1) Do not know about the possibility to have it done with a router 2) Some routers dont have it 3) missing skills of users to set these settings in their routers? 4) As i know, the FW is installed by E25 but wasnt enabled by default and had no gui installed
So, do you think it is a good advice to say to the newbies that they shouldnt know if they have a FW and if that FW is enabled or not? So that they are surfing without the least of protection? Cause your post says that.
I would always try to help newbies to not only have a Linux system but to have a kind of protection too.
There is no need for me to think about those people, because Bodhi doesn't target them. One of Bodhi's focus is minimilism, not having extra stuff not everyone would use installed. So no, unless it is something 90% of people need, I don't think bodhi should include it. There are other distros with tons of crap installed for newbies. In all of history, have you ever heard of a Bodhi user having an issue due to lack of firewall being installed? Nope.
But I would not say it is not good advice to know things. Knowledge is good. Feel free to install yourself firewalls and antivirus and any other crap you want, that's your choice, Bodhi tries to be a minimal canvas allowing you to install whatever you want, whatever config GUI's you want, etc.
Well, I don't think Bodhi should come across as a dry slice of toast, and it doesn't come. The AppPack version is anything but lightweight. And that's a good thing. Surely you don't have to think about other people and their needs. Unfortunately, far too few people do that in this day and age. We are just different. I always try to weigh between a (my) egoism and the fact that I live in a society, so in a community. There it is quite important for me to think of other people. What are their needs, desires, etc. ... Also, I do not think that Bodhi follows a philosophy of a small nerd group who do not care how their work is valued by other people. And there we are again - the other people. I also don't think it's okay to talk about - crap - when other distros go the extra mile and put multiple programs in their distros. This could help Linux to get out of its lonely existence. And yes - I have heard from some people that they miss FWs. By the way also myself. But maybe you don't see me as a Bodhi user.
But I also think that it is now clear where we both stand and how we think. Probably not compatible. Therefore, a discussion between us is not purposeful.
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Post by Hippytaff on Feb 12, 2022 19:22:42 GMT
Minimalism and user choice is the Bodhi philosophy, why we let the user install whatever they wish and provide a minimal base to start from and an app pack for people who want what we think are light good weight apps. That’s kind of the heart of Bodhi, embracing freedom and choice. You’re both kind of saying the same thing from the opposite starting point 🙂
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kev392
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Post by kev392 on Feb 13, 2022 1:30:35 GMT
Minimalism and user choice is the Bodhi philosophy, why we let the user install whatever they wish and provide a minimal base to start from and an app pack for people who want what we think are light good weight apps. That’s kind of the heart of Bodhi, embracing freedom and choice. You’re both kind of saying the same thing from the opposite starting point 🙂 AppPack is only 1.6 GB, so that's less than Linux Mint, which I consider a good middle ground. When I see an iso approaching 3 GB, that's definitely bloat IMO. In the future, it would be nice to list the download file size for each version on the download page. P.S. Try downloading RebornOS. The iso is 2.5 GB, fine. Then the update process takes forever (it's based on Arch Linux). It's beyond ridiculous.
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Post by Hippytaff on Feb 13, 2022 12:16:09 GMT
oblio might be able to make that future the present, he’s good at that kind of thing 🙂
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Post by Deleted on Feb 13, 2022 12:33:33 GMT
We should all calm down from the delusion to release the slimmest distro in the world. Yes, what I read about it here somehow reminds me of a competition of some people who for some personal reasons, personal preferences have this compulsion to release the smallest distro in the world. Then I can just use TailsOS and that's it. I myself have tried pretty much all known Linux versions in the last months. Distros that were sometimes 4.5 GB in size. I didn't care about the download. It was important to me to find the Linux that I like best. No matter whether it is now 1.2 or 4.5 GB large. And that's how most newbies think.
Likewise, you should really take the wishes of users / newbies seriously. If users are looking for extra features, why not try to give it to them? Just because you yourself do not like these features? How arrogant. I have also tested RebornOS and this distro is not even the biggest. FreeBSD DVD Iso has a whopping 4.7 GB. So the real problem is not the download size but if and how the distro installs. With a sloppy installation routine, all programs are simply installed and the user is not asked. With a proper installation routine the user is asked if he wants to have this or that. Very simple. By the way, this is true for all operating systems, not only for Linux. It seems to me that there is some kind of war between the Linux distributions and their "supporters". Who has this and who has that etc..... how awful. Almost like a question of faith. Instead of putting all the energy and love into the distro, some of the programming potential and idea potential gets lost in these unimportant things. Why not simply do what is possible and what you can and then decide how to bring it to the "market"? Without quarrels, envy and the eternal look at the competition distros... Combine forces, ideas, energies and put all the love into your own "child". And Bodhi does it already quite well. 3 different distro packages. It's great. So why get hot under the collar about the different wishes of different users? Pointless. And don't forget the big goal. To bring more people to Linux and to finally take away the tormented user souls from the real "bad guys" Microsoft and Apple. To finally offer people an alternative that is not only visually beautiful but also functionally appealing. No matter if these users want this and other users want this and this or whatever... It is important and necessary to look beyond one's own nose. Sometimes it's not the well-being of individuals that counts, but the well-being of all. And there it is just to find a compromise. This is called maturity. In this sense ;-)
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Post by thewaiter on Feb 13, 2022 12:44:46 GMT
User: "How can I install Bodhi?" me: "Burn ISO on the USB" User: "I do not have USB port" me: "What? Oh, use DVD ROM" User: "too old laptop, no DVD ROM" me: "ouch, OK, I can still help you" User: "Really?" me: "yep. Do you have a CD ROM device?" User: "yes, I have" me: "cool. That's is way " user: "You are the best distro around" me: "exactly " That's the reason why we want to be minimalistic Anyway, it is not easy to shrink ISO to 700 MB nowadays. There are 900 MB CDs on the market available... Stefan
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Post by Hippytaff on Feb 13, 2022 13:48:57 GMT
…and it’s kind of what Bodhi is all about. Why it began, our core value lmao. But yeah, it’s not as important to some as others. At then end of the day the thing that unites all users it that a distro works well. Hopefully we achieve that as well as our core values.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 13, 2022 14:13:38 GMT
User: "How can I install Bodhi?" me: "Burn ISO on the USB" User: "I do not have USB port" me: "What? Oh, use DVD ROM" User: "too old laptop, no DVD ROM" me: "ouch, OK, I can still help you" User: "Really?" me: "yep. Do you have a CD ROM device?" User: "yes, I have" me: "cool. That's is way " user: "You are the best distro around" me: "exactly " That's the reason why we want to be minimalistic Anyway, it is not easy to shrink ISO to 700 MB nowadays. There are 900 MB CDs on the market available... Stefan
I see... so its not for old computer but antique computers. Cause only antique computers doesnt have USB and DVD. Then the question is... do you really think that a Moksha desktop works well and responsive on these antique computers ??
I wouldnt be sure... i can see that Moksha and EL are not that fast on "little-older" computer.. but Ok...
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Post by Hippytaff on Feb 13, 2022 14:16:40 GMT
It works on my 32bit 15 year old laptop. Depends how old is old. I’m 42, and my cpu is on its way out 😂
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